Discussion:
kde and speech
Jude DaShiell
2017-10-11 15:15:16 UTC
Permalink
Have we got any kde screen reader users on this list using speech rather
than magnification for their accessibility?


--
Gustav Degreef
2017-10-11 11:27:34 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jude DaShiell
Have we got any kde screen reader users on this list using speech
rather than magnification for their accessibility?
--
If you are talking about Jovie, yes I use it extensively.  And at
least for the past 3-4 years.  Gustav.
Jude DaShiell
2017-10-11 21:28:32 UTC
Permalink
That's what I'm talking about. I am doing testing for an accessible
linux distribution called slint. They have kde documented as
inaccessible partly because no kde accessible iso exists similar to the
vinux project but using kde. The project developers don't know how to
get jovie up and running once kde is on a system.

If you would be willing to look at one of the project files on
accessibility and willing to offer suggestions for corrections concerning
kde and jovie, probably kde-accessibility would get some more members and
users of jovie. The url if you're interested is:
http://slackware.uk/slint/x86_64/slint-testing/iso/ACCESSIBILITY

On Wed,
11 Oct 2017,
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2017 07:27:34
Subject: Re: kde and speech
Post by Jude DaShiell
Have we got any kde screen reader users on this list using speech
rather than magnification for their accessibility?
--
If you are talking about Jovie, yes I use it extensively.? And at
least for the past 3-4 years.? Gustav.
--
Jeremy Whiting
2017-10-11 21:58:42 UTC
Permalink
Jovie is not a screen reader. It is only useful to speak notifications from
clock, etc. It has been completely replaced by QtSpeech in Qt5 based KDE
applications and Plasma. Jovie will not be ported to Qt5 since QtSpeech
does everything (mostly) that Jovie did. Orca is the recommended screen
reader on plasma systems.

Hope that helps,
Jeremy Whiting
That's what I'm talking about. I am doing testing for an accessible linux
distribution called slint. They have kde documented as inaccessible partly
because no kde accessible iso exists similar to the vinux project but using
kde. The project developers don't know how to get jovie up and running
once kde is on a system.
If you would be willing to look at one of the project files on
accessibility and willing to offer suggestions for corrections concerning
kde and jovie, probably kde-accessibility would get some more members and
http://slackware.uk/slint/x86_64/slint-testing/iso/ACCESSIBILITY
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2017 07:27:34
Subject: Re: kde and speech
Post by Jude DaShiell
Have we got any kde screen reader users on this list using speech
rather than magnification for their accessibility?
--
If you are talking about Jovie, yes I use it extensively.? And at
least for the past 3-4 years.? Gustav.
--
Jude DaShiell
2017-10-11 22:20:56 UTC
Permalink
Yes, that helps very much! With that information I can try a few things
on this end.
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2017 17:58:42
Subject: Re: kde and speech
Jovie is not a screen reader. It is only useful to speak notifications from
clock, etc. It has been completely replaced by QtSpeech in Qt5 based KDE
applications and Plasma. Jovie will not be ported to Qt5 since QtSpeech
does everything (mostly) that Jovie did. Orca is the recommended screen
reader on plasma systems.
Hope that helps,
Jeremy Whiting
That's what I'm talking about. I am doing testing for an accessible linux
distribution called slint. They have kde documented as inaccessible partly
because no kde accessible iso exists similar to the vinux project but using
kde. The project developers don't know how to get jovie up and running
once kde is on a system.
If you would be willing to look at one of the project files on
accessibility and willing to offer suggestions for corrections concerning
kde and jovie, probably kde-accessibility would get some more members and
http://slackware.uk/slint/x86_64/slint-testing/iso/ACCESSIBILITY
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2017 07:27:34
Subject: Re: kde and speech
Post by Jude DaShiell
Have we got any kde screen reader users on this list using speech
rather than magnification for their accessibility?
--
If you are talking about Jovie, yes I use it extensively.? And at
least for the past 3-4 years.? Gustav.
--
--
Mario Fux
2017-10-11 22:29:33 UTC
Permalink
Morning

And regarding KDE Applications and KDE Plasma we did quite some work regarding
accessibility this year at the Randa Meetings. See https://community.kde.org/
Sprints/Randa/2017#Blogs or planet.kde.org in general for things we did.

There were some tests of using Plasma with Orca so there is some progress.

griits
Mario
Post by Jude DaShiell
Yes, that helps very much! With that information I can try a few things
on this end.
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2017 17:58:42
Subject: Re: kde and speech
Jovie is not a screen reader. It is only useful to speak notifications from
clock, etc. It has been completely replaced by QtSpeech in Qt5 based KDE
applications and Plasma. Jovie will not be ported to Qt5 since QtSpeech
does everything (mostly) that Jovie did. Orca is the recommended screen
reader on plasma systems.
Hope that helps,
Jeremy Whiting
That's what I'm talking about. I am doing testing for an accessible linux
distribution called slint. They have kde documented as inaccessible partly
because no kde accessible iso exists similar to the vinux project but using
kde. The project developers don't know how to get jovie up and running
once kde is on a system.
If you would be willing to look at one of the project files on
accessibility and willing to offer suggestions for corrections concerning
kde and jovie, probably kde-accessibility would get some more members and
http://slackware.uk/slint/x86_64/slint-testing/iso/ACCESSIBILITY
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2017 07:27:34
Subject: Re: kde and speech
Post by Jude DaShiell
Have we got any kde screen reader users on this list using speech
rather than magnification for their accessibility?
--
If you are talking about Jovie, yes I use it extensively.? And at
least for the past 3-4 years.? Gustav.
--
Alex ARNAUD
2017-10-12 08:19:32 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mario Fux
Morning
And regarding KDE Applications and KDE Plasma we did quite some work regarding
accessibility this year at the Randa Meetings. See https://community.kde.org/
Sprints/Randa/2017#Blogs or planet.kde.org in general for things we did.
There were some tests of using Plasma with Orca so there is some progress.
Hello Mario,

I'm also interested to help to make KDE and more generally Qt
applications accessibles.

Could it be possible to you to summarize the actual state and roadmap in
a specific thread ? And exactly what do you need ?

Best regards.
--
Alex ARNAUD
Frederik Gladhorn
2017-10-12 10:42:38 UTC
Permalink
I think the state is that the basics are there and Orca for now is the screen
reader of choice.

What is badly missing is actual testing now and there are very many rough
edges, so don't expect smooth sailing yet. The Plasma team was very helpful in
trying to fix issues and I assume they continue down that path when asked
nicely!

Some notes are here, I think this todo board needs more additions and feedback
though:
https://phabricator.kde.org/tag/plasma_accessibility/

Cheers,
Frederik
Post by Alex ARNAUD
Post by Mario Fux
Morning
And regarding KDE Applications and KDE Plasma we did quite some work
regarding accessibility this year at the Randa Meetings. See
https://community.kde.org/ Sprints/Randa/2017#Blogs or planet.kde.org in
general for things we did.
There were some tests of using Plasma with Orca so there is some progress.
Hello Mario,
I'm also interested to help to make KDE and more generally Qt
applications accessibles.
Could it be possible to you to summarize the actual state and roadmap in
a specific thread ? And exactly what do you need ?
Best regards.
Jude DaShiell
2017-10-12 11:08:42 UTC
Permalink
I'm figuring road map to a plasma system with orca running on it until
kde gets its own accessibility iso released would be something like
this:
1) install a linux graphical user interface accessibility iso vinux
sonar slint would be three possibilities.
2) get orca running and install kde on the system with package manager.
3) run xwmconfig in orca and choose kde.
4) reboot the system.
5) start orca.

I don't know if step 5 will have to be repeated after each reboot or
system start in the future yet.
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2017 18:29:33
Subject: Re: kde and speech
Morning
And regarding KDE Applications and KDE Plasma we did quite some work regarding
accessibility this year at the Randa Meetings. See https://community.kde.org/
Sprints/Randa/2017#Blogs or planet.kde.org in general for things we did.
There were some tests of using Plasma with Orca so there is some progress.
griits
Mario
Post by Jude DaShiell
Yes, that helps very much! With that information I can try a few things
on this end.
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2017 17:58:42
Subject: Re: kde and speech
Jovie is not a screen reader. It is only useful to speak notifications from
clock, etc. It has been completely replaced by QtSpeech in Qt5 based KDE
applications and Plasma. Jovie will not be ported to Qt5 since QtSpeech
does everything (mostly) that Jovie did. Orca is the recommended screen
reader on plasma systems.
Hope that helps,
Jeremy Whiting
That's what I'm talking about. I am doing testing for an accessible linux
distribution called slint. They have kde documented as inaccessible partly
because no kde accessible iso exists similar to the vinux project but using
kde. The project developers don't know how to get jovie up and running
once kde is on a system.
If you would be willing to look at one of the project files on
accessibility and willing to offer suggestions for corrections concerning
kde and jovie, probably kde-accessibility would get some more members and
http://slackware.uk/slint/x86_64/slint-testing/iso/ACCESSIBILITY
Date: Wed, 11 Oct 2017 07:27:34
Subject: Re: kde and speech
Post by Jude DaShiell
Have we got any kde screen reader users on this list using speech
rather than magnification for their accessibility?
--
If you are talking about Jovie, yes I use it extensively.? And at
least for the past 3-4 years.? Gustav.
--
--
Gustav Degreef
2017-10-12 11:23:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Whiting
Jovie is not a screen reader. It is only useful to speak notifications
from clock, etc.
snip
Post by Jeremy Whiting
 Orca is the recommended screen reader on plasma systems.
Perhaps Jovie is not technically a screen reader, but it is well
integrated into Okular and some other KDE applications.   In PDF files,
with Okular I select the text and right click.  A context menu opens
that has an option to read out the text.  In other applications, like
the browser, word processor or e-mail client, I just select the text,
then right click the Jovie icon in the system tray, and select the
option to read out the selected text, stop reading, etc.  I am seriously
visually impaired for more than 3 years, Jovie in a sense has saved my
life.  I tried four years back to integrate Orca into my KDE desktop and
I found it too difficult and cumbersome.

It would be very helpful to know where instructions are that describe
how to integrate Orca into KDE and use it as easily as Jovie can be
used.  A number of people who hear the output of Jovie comment that the
voices are terrible.  It would be great if Orca is a good replacement
with better sounding voices.   Gustav.
Jeremy Whiting
2017-10-12 17:33:32 UTC
Permalink
Hi Gustav,
Post by Gustav Degreef
Post by Jeremy Whiting
Jovie is not a screen reader. It is only useful to speak notifications
from clock, etc.
snip
Post by Jeremy Whiting
Orca is the recommended screen reader on plasma systems.
Perhaps Jovie is not technically a screen reader, but it is well
integrated into Okular and some other KDE applications. In PDF files,
with Okular I select the text and right click. A context menu opens
that has an option to read out the text. In other applications, like
the browser, word processor or e-mail client, I just select the text,
then right click the Jovie icon in the system tray, and select the
option to read out the selected text, stop reading, etc. I am seriously
visually impaired for more than 3 years, Jovie in a sense has saved my
life. I tried four years back to integrate Orca into my KDE desktop and
I found it too difficult and cumbersome.
It would be very helpful to know where instructions are that describe
how to integrate Orca into KDE and use it as easily as Jovie can be
used. A number of people who hear the output of Jovie comment that the
voices are terrible. It would be great if Orca is a good replacement
with better sounding voices. Gustav.
I'm glad Jovie has been helpful for you. I need an excuse to get back into
KDE development again, this might be just the thing to get me there. Can I
ask you a few questions to make sure the stuff I add/suggest is usable for
you quickly?

1. What distribution of linux are you using with Jovie?
2. Which version of that distribution are you running?

I am very confident I can create functionality in plasma or try with orca
to get the functionality that you are used to. Orca and Jovie both use
Speech-Dispatcher to do the speech synthesis which uses espeak by default
but can be easily changed to use mbrola which sounds slightly better or
pico (the same voices from Android) if pico is available on your
distribution. Once I know the distribution you are using I can guide you
through setting up Jovie/Speech-dispatcher to use these better quality
voices then see what we need to do to get orca working well also and/or the
Jovie "speak text from clipboard" functionality in plasma itself using
QtSpeech.

thanks,
Jeremy
Gustav Degreef
2017-10-12 13:43:36 UTC
Permalink
Post by Jeremy Whiting
Hi Gustav,
......
I'm glad Jovie has been helpful for you. I need an excuse to get back
into KDE development again, this might be just the thing to get me
there. Can I ask you a few questions to make sure the stuff I
add/suggest is usable for you quickly?
1. What distribution of linux are you using with Jovie?
opensuse 42.2 and 42.3.  I've used it with opensuse as far back as 11.0
I think (not sure when I started using it) if not earlier.  Also used it
with Debian 6 and 7.
Post by Jeremy Whiting
I am very confident I can create functionality in plasma or try with
orca to get the functionality that you are used to. Orca and Jovie
both use Speech-Dispatcher to do the speech synthesis which uses
espeak by default but can be easily changed to use mbrola which sounds
slightly better or pico (the same voices from Android) if pico is
available on your distribution. Once I know the distribution you are
using I can guide you through setting up Jovie/Speech-dispatcher to
use these better quality voices
That would be fantastic.  Several months back I tried to switch from
e-speak (at the prompting of my wife who has to hear it so often :)  )
but I got bogged down and could not succeed.
Post by Jeremy Whiting
then see what we need to do to get orca working well also and/or the
Jovie "speak text from clipboard" functionality in plasma itself using
QtSpeech.
thanks,
Jeremy
ANY help would be greatly welcome.  The voice bothers others quite a
bit.  For me, it is so so helpful I tend ot overlook the tiny grating
quality.  The functionality that is missing for me is not being able
to pause and re-start the speech in jovie.  I can not pause in mid
text and resume.  This would be immensely helpful as I have books and
book chapters that are very hard to manage without this
functionality.  Thanks, Gustav.
Jude DaShiell
2017-10-14 21:37:12 UTC
Permalink
I needed to build qtatspi and got it installed. What app can I use to
test it and what should I listen for iwith respect to output to test the
build of the app?
Date: Thu, 12 Oct 2017 13:33:32
Subject: Re: kde and speech
Hi Gustav,
Post by Gustav Degreef
Post by Jeremy Whiting
Jovie is not a screen reader. It is only useful to speak notifications
from clock, etc.
snip
Post by Jeremy Whiting
Orca is the recommended screen reader on plasma systems.
Perhaps Jovie is not technically a screen reader, but it is well
integrated into Okular and some other KDE applications. In PDF files,
with Okular I select the text and right click. A context menu opens
that has an option to read out the text. In other applications, like
the browser, word processor or e-mail client, I just select the text,
then right click the Jovie icon in the system tray, and select the
option to read out the selected text, stop reading, etc. I am seriously
visually impaired for more than 3 years, Jovie in a sense has saved my
life. I tried four years back to integrate Orca into my KDE desktop and
I found it too difficult and cumbersome.
It would be very helpful to know where instructions are that describe
how to integrate Orca into KDE and use it as easily as Jovie can be
used. A number of people who hear the output of Jovie comment that the
voices are terrible. It would be great if Orca is a good replacement
with better sounding voices. Gustav.
I'm glad Jovie has been helpful for you. I need an excuse to get back into
KDE development again, this might be just the thing to get me there. Can I
ask you a few questions to make sure the stuff I add/suggest is usable for
you quickly?
1. What distribution of linux are you using with Jovie?
2. Which version of that distribution are you running?
I am very confident I can create functionality in plasma or try with orca
to get the functionality that you are used to. Orca and Jovie both use
Speech-Dispatcher to do the speech synthesis which uses espeak by default
but can be easily changed to use mbrola which sounds slightly better or
pico (the same voices from Android) if pico is available on your
distribution. Once I know the distribution you are using I can guide you
through setting up Jovie/Speech-dispatcher to use these better quality
voices then see what we need to do to get orca working well also and/or the
Jovie "speak text from clipboard" functionality in plasma itself using
QtSpeech.
thanks,
Jeremy
--

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