[Kde-accessibility] experimental idea with colour fonts

[michel]

i suggested the idea a few years back. I neglected it since then.
https://forum.kde.org/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=93881

in short, the idea is for the people that are partially blind and rely on the
magnifying lens. .... of course it's also "kool" :P .

Instead of relying only on the shape of the letters, they could instaid read
by distinguishing the colours of the letters. This should ease reading,
because more readable text can be crammed in the scream. There is some
learning involved, but it can be incremental and relatively painless.

I've seen on TV, some people that need to literally put there nose just in
front of the screen, with the letters taking over the whole hight of the
screen to be able to read. These kind of people would benefit the most.

The proper way to do it, would be to implement part of the SVG fonts.
The hacker way, would be to permit for individual letters to have there own
colours/background colour in KDE applications. For example, all "a" are red
with yellow background, all "b" are green with purple background. As an extra
hack, new fonts can be made, specifically for this use, that's unrelated with
the developers here.

I think the hacker way isn't too difficult. Right?
I'm not a programmer, isn't my idea simple enough and worth implementing?
What you think? Why you wouldn't want to implement the hacker solution?

I think it's an idea that is worth looking in to.

I would like to discuss it a bit.

Thank you for reading.
:D

(...yea, it's a through away email address, call me quantum immortal)

[Frederik Gladhorn]

Hi Michel,

I don't think anyone has time to work on your proposal at the moment. I would
like feedback from people that this is helpful at least - I guess you can
easily create documents with this kind of color scheme to let people try.

Greetings,
Frederik

Post by michel
i suggested the idea a few years back. I neglected it since then.
https://forum.kde.org/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=93881
in short, the idea is for the people that are partially blind and rely on
the magnifying lens. .... of course it's also "kool" :P .
Instead of relying only on the shape of the letters, they could instaid read
by distinguishing the colours of the letters. This should ease reading,
because more readable text can be crammed in the scream. There is some
learning involved, but it can be incremental and relatively painless.
I've seen on TV, some people that need to literally put there nose just in
front of the screen, with the letters taking over the whole hight of the
screen to be able to read. These kind of people would benefit the most.
The proper way to do it, would be to implement part of the SVG fonts.
The hacker way, would be to permit for individual letters to have there own
colours/background colour in KDE applications. For example, all "a" are red
with yellow background, all "b" are green with purple background. As an
extra hack, new fonts can be made, specifically for this use, that's
unrelated with the developers here.
I think the hacker way isn't too difficult. Right?
I'm not a programmer, isn't my idea simple enough and worth implementing?
What you think? Why you wouldn't want to implement the hacker solution?
I think it's an idea that is worth looking in to.
I would like to discuss it a bit.
Thank you for reading.
:D
(...yea, it's a through away email address, call me quantum immortal)
_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

[michel]

hi Frederik

Fair enough.

Right now i'm actively asking for the simple method with individual colours
per character. Not the SVG fonts, that's too much for a new idea. The simple
method is what? A few days work from some one that knows KDE internals
already?

i'm not totally impreprepared.

i somehow made a little kate script ... that is now broken. (i made some
blurred and normal screen shots, to demonstrate that you can decipher the
letters if you know the colour code used, despite been impossible to see their
shapes)
i also made a simple grease monkey script .... but the userscripts site died.
I also made a simple compiling script in bash for text files.

So i already made some proof of concept scripts that we can experiment the
idea with. (Don't ask me do do it in C++ however... B[ , it's too low level
for me )

Do you know where to find people to tort... i mean test the idea on to? :D
I think people here are beater networked then me for this.
And we'll get the feedback on this :D

Michel

Post by Frederik Gladhorn
Hi Michel,
I don't think anyone has time to work on your proposal at the moment. I
would like feedback from people that this is helpful at least - I guess you
can easily create documents with this kind of color scheme to let people
try.
Greetings,
Frederik

Post by michel
i suggested the idea a few years back. I neglected it since then.
https://forum.kde.org/viewtopic.php?f=83&t=93881
in short, the idea is for the people that are partially blind and rely on
the magnifying lens. .... of course it's also "kool" :P .
Instead of relying only on the shape of the letters, they could instaid
read by distinguishing the colours of the letters. This should ease
reading, because more readable text can be crammed in the scream. There
is some learning involved, but it can be incremental and relatively
painless.
I've seen on TV, some people that need to literally put there nose just in
front of the screen, with the letters taking over the whole hight of the
screen to be able to read. These kind of people would benefit the most.
The proper way to do it, would be to implement part of the SVG fonts.
The hacker way, would be to permit for individual letters to have there own
colours/background colour in KDE applications. For example, all "a" are red
with yellow background, all "b" are green with purple background. As an
extra hack, new fonts can be made, specifically for this use, that's
unrelated with the developers here.
I think the hacker way isn't too difficult. Right?
I'm not a programmer, isn't my idea simple enough and worth implementing?
What you think? Why you wouldn't want to implement the hacker solution?
I think it's an idea that is worth looking in to.
I would like to discuss it a bit.
Thank you for reading.
:D
(...yea, it's a through away email address, call me quantum immortal)
_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

[Heiko Tietze]

Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 14:57:32 +0200
Subject: Re: [Kde-accessibility] experimental idea with colour fonts
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
i somehow made a little kate script ... that is now broken. (i made some
blurred and normal screen shots, to demonstrate that you can decipher the
letters if you know the colour code used, despite been impossible to see
their shapes)

I like those ideas, in particular when they can get tested easily. Katepart
(that means the following works in Kate and KWrite etc.) has an elaborated
highlighting [1], which is easy to modify. (This is my first attempt to create
a syntax highlighting file; for sure there is much room for improvement.)

1. Download the highlight definitions from http://pastebin.com/GzkH7AJb
2. Place it at ~/.kde4/share/apps/katepart/syntax/ (create the syntax folder
if it doesn't exists) under the name coloredtext.xml
3. (Re)start Kate, go to Extra > Highlighting > Markup and select "Colored
Text"
4. Download the color scheme from http://pastebin.com/GsVSw3JY and save it
anywhere under the name coloredtext.katehlcolor
5. In Kate/KWrite go to Settings > Fonts & Colors, tab "Styles for
highlighting", find Markup/Colored Text at the dropdown (if not selected) and
load the color definition via "Import" from the downloaded file

Now every letter gets its own color. And you can modify the scheme as you want

Beside from the technical solution I believe it makes sense to define the
highlighting carefully. The proof-of-concept scheme is just multicolored
without any concept. What I have in mind is to put syllables or rather
phonemes into foreground, and to move less important letters backward (vocals
for instance).
But perhaps an individual solution would be even better. For a scientific study
I would measure eye fixations and highlight those parts later that got special
attention, that means a high number or long duration of fixations.
Unfortunately the resolution and framerate of inbuilt webcams is not sufficient,
as far as I know. So we cannot provide this as a generic accessibility tool.

Cheers,
Heiko.

[1] http://kate-editor.org/2005/03/24/writing-a-syntax-highlighting-file/

[Reinhard Thies]

Hi,

I am a visually impaired user. Changing the background to black and have a
white font is very helpful for me. But many application do not support it.
they simply ignore system settings.
I can only see a small area of the screen and therefore the tracking mouse
pointer and the circles around the mouse pointer when you press control are
wonderful things, available in Windows OS. These are the things which would
make life easier.

thanks
Reinhard

Post by Heiko Tietze

Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 14:57:32 +0200
Subject: Re: [Kde-accessibility] experimental idea with colour fonts
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
i somehow made a little kate script ... that is now broken. (i made some
blurred and normal screen shots, to demonstrate that you can decipher the
letters if you know the colour code used, despite been impossible to see
their shapes)

I like those ideas, in particular when they can get tested easily. Katepart
(that means the following works in Kate and KWrite etc.) has an elaborated
highlighting [1], which is easy to modify. (This is my first attempt to
create a syntax highlighting file; for sure there is much room for
improvement.)
1. Download the highlight definitions from http://pastebin.com/GzkH7AJb
2. Place it at ~/.kde4/share/apps/katepart/syntax/ (create the syntax
folder if it doesn't exists) under the name coloredtext.xml
3. (Re)start Kate, go to Extra > Highlighting > Markup and select "Colored
Text"
4. Download the color scheme from http://pastebin.com/GsVSw3JY and save it
anywhere under the name coloredtext.katehlcolor
5. In Kate/KWrite go to Settings > Fonts & Colors, tab "Styles for
highlighting", find Markup/Colored Text at the dropdown (if not selected)
and load the color definition via "Import" from the downloaded file
Now every letter gets its own color. And you can modify the scheme as you want
Beside from the technical solution I believe it makes sense to define the
highlighting carefully. The proof-of-concept scheme is just multicolored
without any concept. What I have in mind is to put syllables or rather
phonemes into foreground, and to move less important letters backward
(vocals for instance).
But perhaps an individual solution would be even better. For a scientific
study I would measure eye fixations and highlight those parts later that
got special attention, that means a high number or long duration of
fixations. Unfortunately the resolution and framerate of inbuilt webcams
is not sufficient, as far as I know. So we cannot provide this as a
generic accessibility tool.
Cheers,
Heiko.
[1] http://kate-editor.org/2005/03/24/writing-a-syntax-highlighting-file/
_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

[Heiko Tietze]

Hi Thies,

it's always good to read experiences from affected users. I guess you manage
the black/white stuff pretty well. If you need a certain app to get fixed or
improved just tell us which one it is, or write a bug report. This thread was
basically meant to discuss the idea of colored text to support dyslexic, or
similar impairments. The question is whether or not it would help if
characters (or maybe syllables) get a further identification by a color.

[michel]

Dear Reinhard

About the colour fonts, it is meant to be experimental.
the details depend on your situation.
It is meant, that it will be used in combination with other methods.
Not just that on it's own.

Maybe you misunderstood the strategy here. Basically, we just redefine the
alphabet, to what ever it's easier on the senses of the user.

We don't try to make the shapes of the letters easier to see. We largely
ignore the shapes. The idea is, that the user sees a colourful string of
blurry letters, and deciphers the meaning by knowing the colour code (that he
defined). Combination with other methods of course is not forbidden.

for example, if every "a" is red. When you see a red smug, you know that
there's a "a" there. Additionally, it can have it's own background colour.
Say, a red "a" with a blue background. Using a single colour for every letter
might be too difficult to distinguish between them. During the learning phase,
if you can't read something, you can use the lens to refresh your memory. When
the knew colour alphabet is learned, you can use different "fonts", say
rectangles or triangles, in order to amplify the visibility of the colours and
increase screen density of readable text. The exact colour scheme should be
chosen carefully by the user, or they will be "dyslexia" kind of problems with
colours been mixed up.....

.... Do you want to be our guinea pig? We'll send you some experimental
scripts for testing and you tell us how it's going....

About what you said about windows. In KDE, you can invert the colours and
track the mouse already. It inverts the colours of the entire system, so
individual applications aren't an issue. And there is also a lens..... and
automated reading and other stuff. I'm pretty sure the other Linux GUIs do all
that also. I think Linux already does every thing that is standard in
accessibility. And this is why it's not a bad idea, to try something new... :P

regards

Michel

Post by Reinhard Thies
Hi,
I am a visually impaired user. Changing the background to black and have a
white font is very helpful for me. But many application do not support it.
they simply ignore system settings.
I can only see a small area of the screen and therefore the tracking mouse
pointer and the circles around the mouse pointer when you press control are
wonderful things, available in Windows OS. These are the things which would
make life easier.
thanks
Reinhard

Post by Heiko Tietze

Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2014 14:57:32 +0200
Subject: Re: [Kde-accessibility] experimental idea with colour fonts
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
i somehow made a little kate script ... that is now broken. (i made some
blurred and normal screen shots, to demonstrate that you can decipher the
letters if you know the colour code used, despite been impossible to see
their shapes)

I like those ideas, in particular when they can get tested easily. Katepart
(that means the following works in Kate and KWrite etc.) has an elaborated
highlighting [1], which is easy to modify. (This is my first attempt to
create a syntax highlighting file; for sure there is much room for
improvement.)
1. Download the highlight definitions from http://pastebin.com/GzkH7AJb
2. Place it at ~/.kde4/share/apps/katepart/syntax/ (create the syntax
folder if it doesn't exists) under the name coloredtext.xml
3. (Re)start Kate, go to Extra > Highlighting > Markup and select "Colored
Text"
4. Download the color scheme from http://pastebin.com/GsVSw3JY and save it
anywhere under the name coloredtext.katehlcolor
5. In Kate/KWrite go to Settings > Fonts & Colors, tab "Styles for
highlighting", find Markup/Colored Text at the dropdown (if not selected)
and load the color definition via "Import" from the downloaded file
Now every letter gets its own color. And you can modify the scheme as you want
Beside from the technical solution I believe it makes sense to define the
highlighting carefully. The proof-of-concept scheme is just multicolored
without any concept. What I have in mind is to put syllables or rather
phonemes into foreground, and to move less important letters backward
(vocals for instance).
But perhaps an individual solution would be even better. For a scientific
study I would measure eye fixations and highlight those parts later that
got special attention, that means a high number or long duration of
fixations. Unfortunately the resolution and framerate of inbuilt webcams
is not sufficient, as far as I know. So we cannot provide this as a
generic accessibility tool.
Cheers,
Heiko.
[1] http://kate-editor.org/2005/03/24/writing-a-syntax-highlighting-file/
_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

[michel]

theirs a static mirror of grease monkey user scripts, and i found my script
http://www.webextender.net/scripts/show/96470.html

My script works in latest Firefox.
Warning, it's slow!!!! No, it hasn't crashed, just wait
The default uses an image alphabet(a=apple, b=bouncing ball etc...), need to
download the pictures. It's just a demonstration, i just grabbed some pictures
from photobucket, i didn't do any attempt to be efficient.
In the scrip, you can define pictures or colours. By default it uses the urls
of the pictures if given, other wise it just uses the definition of the
colours.

from the greasemonkey script, you can see what i have in mind.


katepart highlight from Heiko

Post by Heiko Tietze

Post by michel
i somehow made a little kate script ... that is now broken. (i made some
blurred and normal screen shots, to demonstrate that you can decipher the
letters if you know the colour code used, despite been impossible to see
their shapes)

I like those ideas, in particular when they can get tested easily. Katepart
(that means the following works in Kate and KWrite etc.) has an elaborated
highlighting [1], which is easy to modify. (This is my first attempt to
create a syntax highlighting file; for sure there is much room for
improvement.)
1. Download the highlight definitions from http://pastebin.com/GzkH7AJb
2. Place it at ~/.kde4/share/apps/katepart/syntax/ (create the syntax folder
if it doesn't exists) under the name coloredtext.xml
3. (Re)start Kate, go to Extra > Highlighting > Markup and select "Colored
Text"
4. Download the color scheme from http://pastebin.com/GsVSw3JY and save it
anywhere under the name coloredtext.katehlcolor
5. In Kate/KWrite go to Settings > Fonts & Colors, tab "Styles for
highlighting", find Markup/Colored Text at the dropdown (if not selected)
and load the color definition via "Import" from the downloaded file
Now every letter gets its own color. And you can modify the scheme as you want

Any willing guinea pig? :D
Seriously, i'm looking for people to test it on.

[hkujk ipjmo]

oh dear, my old kate highlights still works after all....

Why i got confused about it?


you can get it from here, nice screenshot also available

http://kde-files.org/content/show.php/Colors+alphabet?content=140780


depending on your system, you need to save it in

~/.kde/share/apps/katepart/syntax

or

~/.kde4/share/apps/katepart/syntax/


restart kate

open some text

Tools > highlighting > other > colors alphabet

dada...


that was the default

easy configuration

Settings > configure kate > fonts and colors > highlighting text styles

make sure you are on "other/colors alphabet"

edit it to your liking

Post by michel
theirs a static mirror of grease monkey user scripts, and i found my

script

Post by michel
http://www.webextender.net/scripts/show/96470.html
My script works in latest Firefox.
Warning, it's slow!!!! No, it hasn't crashed, just wait
The default uses an image alphabet(a=apple, b=bouncing ball etc...), need

to

Post by michel
download the pictures. It's just a demonstration, i just grabbed some
pictures from photobucket, i didn't do any attempt to be efficient.
In the scrip, you can define pictures or colours. By default it uses the
urls of the pictures if given, other wise it just uses the definition of
the colours.
from the greasemonkey script, you can see what i have in mind.
katepart highlight from Heiko

Post by Heiko Tietze

Post by michel
i somehow made a little kate script ... that is now broken. (i made

some

Post by michel

Post by Heiko Tietze

Post by michel
blurred and normal screen shots, to demonstrate that you can decipher
the
letters if you know the colour code used, despite been impossible to

see

Post by michel

Post by Heiko Tietze

Post by michel
their shapes)

I like those ideas, in particular when they can get tested easily.
Katepart
(that means the following works in Kate and KWrite etc.) has an

elaborated

Post by michel

Post by Heiko Tietze
highlighting [1], which is easy to modify. (This is my first attempt to
create a syntax highlighting file; for sure there is much room for
improvement.)
1. Download the highlight definitions from http://pastebin.com/GzkH7AJb
2. Place it at ~/.kde4/share/apps/katepart/syntax/ (create the syntax
folder if it doesn't exists) under the name coloredtext.xml
3. (Re)start Kate, go to Extra > Highlighting > Markup and select

"Colored

Post by michel

Post by Heiko Tietze
Text"
4. Download the color scheme from http://pastebin.com/GsVSw3JY and save

it

Post by michel

Post by Heiko Tietze
anywhere under the name coloredtext.katehlcolor
5. In Kate/KWrite go to Settings > Fonts & Colors, tab "Styles for
highlighting", find Markup/Colored Text at the dropdown (if not

selected)

Post by michel

Post by Heiko Tietze
and load the color definition via "Import" from the downloaded file
Now every letter gets its own color. And you can modify the scheme as

you

Post by michel

Post by Heiko Tietze
want

Any willing guinea pig? :D
Seriously, i'm looking for people to test it on.
_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

[Ovidiu-Florin Bogdan]

This seems like a good idea to me.

I would recommend making a sample webpage, or a mini app, and do some
research with it on people that have visual problems. Get some feedback
from them, make some changes, find out which color combinations are
best. Find out if they would like to habe something like that on their
computer, and how much it would help them.

And finnaly make a report with all that.

I don't think implementing this in KDE would be problematic, but it must be
worth it. The development time could take some time, and no one will do
this if it turns out to be useless, or unused. The report I've mentione would
be a good selling point for the ideea.


*Ovidiu-Florin Bogdan*
GeekAliens.com[1]
Kubuntu România[2]

--------
[1] http://GeekAliens.com
[2] http://ro.kubuntu.org

[michel]

Well, there's the greasemonkey script and the kate highlights definitions that
i made... I mention them on an other email

The colours have to be user defined, not hard coded. I don't see the point in
trying to define a certain colour code. The user can always just change the
definitions to his liking/abilities.... Also i don't think it's that difficult to
do.

Most importantly, where do i find people with visual problems?
That's more difficult then it looks like.
Can some one please help with this point?
We'll use the scripts i already made on them, and they'll report back here.

Can some one help with finding test subjects? I'm not networked with people
like that....

It isn't possible for KDE-accessibility to ask it's user to participate in a
little experiment?

Is there any KDE-accessibility leader reading this?

Post by Ovidiu-Florin Bogdan
This seems like a good idea to me.
I would recommend making a sample webpage, or a mini app, and do some
research with it on people that have visual problems. Get some feedback
from them, make some changes, find out which color combinations are
best. Find out if they would like to habe something like that on their
computer, and how much it would help them.
And finnaly make a report with all that.
I don't think implementing this in KDE would be problematic, but it must be
worth it. The development time could take some time, and no one will do
this if it turns out to be useless, or unused. The report I've mentione
would be a good selling point for the ideea.
*Ovidiu-Florin Bogdan*
GeekAliens.com[1]
Kubuntu România[2]
--------
[1] http://GeekAliens.com
[2] http://ro.kubuntu.org

[Jeremy Whiting]

Michel,

That's the problem there. We developers of KDE-Accessibility
applications don't know our users. The KDE Community is trying to get
something figured out in this regard to help us find and reach out to
our users but it's not in place yet. Currently the only way we have
any knowledge of who's using our software is feedback we get by
e-mail, forums, or bug reports. This is very likely a very small
percentage of the users of KDE software itself and most likely not a
very good group of those that find kde accessibility software useful
or required for their situations unfortunately. If you have any ideas
for how we could contact more users and find out who they are, what
their needs are etc. we are open to ideas.

BR,
Jeremy

Post by michel
Well, there's the greasemonkey script and the kate highlights definitions that
i made... I mention them on an other email
The colours have to be user defined, not hard coded. I don't see the point in
trying to define a certain colour code. The user can always just change the
definitions to his liking/abilities.... Also i don't think it's that difficult to
do.
Most importantly, where do i find people with visual problems?
That's more difficult then it looks like.
Can some one please help with this point?
We'll use the scripts i already made on them, and they'll report back here.
Can some one help with finding test subjects? I'm not networked with people
like that....
It isn't possible for KDE-accessibility to ask it's user to participate in a
little experiment?
Is there any KDE-accessibility leader reading this?

Post by Ovidiu-Florin Bogdan
This seems like a good idea to me.
I would recommend making a sample webpage, or a mini app, and do some
research with it on people that have visual problems. Get some feedback
from them, make some changes, find out which color combinations are
best. Find out if they would like to habe something like that on their
computer, and how much it would help them.
And finnaly make a report with all that.
I don't think implementing this in KDE would be problematic, but it must be
worth it. The development time could take some time, and no one will do
this if it turns out to be useless, or unused. The report I've mentione
would be a good selling point for the ideea.
*Ovidiu-Florin Bogdan*
GeekAliens.com[1]
Kubuntu România[2]
--------
[1] http://GeekAliens.com
[2] http://ro.kubuntu.org

_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

[michel]

hmmm

what about starting with adding in the default installation the colour
alphabet highlights for kate/kword i made? (very simple, not the coding of the
century)
It's everyday usable. Need to change the default to something smarter, i just
put in something random.
i think it will be at least as useful as the ascii art driver for vlc :P

An idea:

They are a bunch of charities on the web. We could ask them to test the idea.
But KDE has to do that, not me. Maybe along side with Firefox? (KDE would have
to ask Firefox, not me....)
KDE/Firefox would pledge to implement the idea, if the tests seam conclusive.
There should be in advance some agreement, about what implement and conclusive
means.

(oh joy, free software politics)

What you think?

Post by Frederik Gladhorn
Michel,
That's the problem there. We developers of KDE-Accessibility
applications don't know our users. The KDE Community is trying to get
something figured out in this regard to help us find and reach out to
our users but it's not in place yet. Currently the only way we have
any knowledge of who's using our software is feedback we get by
e-mail, forums, or bug reports. This is very likely a very small
percentage of the users of KDE software itself and most likely not a
very good group of those that find kde accessibility software useful
or required for their situations unfortunately. If you have any ideas
for how we could contact more users and find out who they are, what
their needs are etc. we are open to ideas.
BR,
Jeremy

Post by michel
Well, there's the greasemonkey script and the kate highlights definitions
that i made... I mention them on an other email
The colours have to be user defined, not hard coded. I don't see the point
in trying to define a certain colour code. The user can always just
change the definitions to his liking/abilities.... Also i don't think
it's that difficult to do.
Most importantly, where do i find people with visual problems?
That's more difficult then it looks like.
Can some one please help with this point?
We'll use the scripts i already made on them, and they'll report back here.
Can some one help with finding test subjects? I'm not networked with people
like that....
It isn't possible for KDE-accessibility to ask it's user to participate in
a little experiment?
Is there any KDE-accessibility leader reading this?

Post by Ovidiu-Florin Bogdan
This seems like a good idea to me.
I would recommend making a sample webpage, or a mini app, and do some
research with it on people that have visual problems. Get some feedback
from them, make some changes, find out which color combinations are
best. Find out if they would like to habe something like that on their
computer, and how much it would help them.
And finnaly make a report with all that.
I don't think implementing this in KDE would be problematic, but it must be
worth it. The development time could take some time, and no one will do
this if it turns out to be useless, or unused. The report I've mentione
would be a good selling point for the ideea.
*Ovidiu-Florin Bogdan*
GeekAliens.com[1]
Kubuntu România[2]
--------
[1] http://GeekAliens.com
[2] http://ro.kubuntu.org

_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

[Gustav Degreef]

Hello,

I have serious vision problems and I've been using KDE for about 14
years. I do 90% of my computer work on linux. I am also a physician
who used to do clinical research. I am not entirely clear about the
idea of the colors/fonts yet I have read quite a bit of this thread.
Perhaps I missed some messages.

But maybe I can make a suggestion. Have a dialogue with a few visually
impaired KDE users. Find out from them where KDE is helpful and what
is missing pr needs improvement. Work/communicate directly with a few
visually impaired users. One can then "experiment" see how this idea
fits with what is needed, what could be done to put it into an
application or function. Then that preliminary application can be
tested further with a few more users. Once the application or function
is relatively mature it is ready to be tested on a larger scale. By
then one should be able to find a larger "population" of test subjects
with a more clearly defined type of visual impairment. There are
different types of visual impairment and a variety of possible "tools"
that can help. Hope this is of some use, Gustav.

Post by michel
hmmm
what about starting with adding in the default installation the colour
alphabet highlights for kate/kword i made? (very simple, not the coding of the
century)
It's everyday usable. Need to change the default to something smarter, i just
put in something random.
i think it will be at least as useful as the ascii art driver for vlc :P
They are a bunch of charities on the web. We could ask them to test the idea.
But KDE has to do that, not me. Maybe along side with Firefox? (KDE would have
to ask Firefox, not me....)
KDE/Firefox would pledge to implement the idea, if the tests seam conclusive.
There should be in advance some agreement, about what implement and conclusive
means.
(oh joy, free software politics)
What you think?

Post by Frederik Gladhorn
Michel,
That's the problem there. We developers of KDE-Accessibility
applications don't know our users. The KDE Community is trying to get
something figured out in this regard to help us find and reach out to
our users but it's not in place yet. Currently the only way we have
any knowledge of who's using our software is feedback we get by
e-mail, forums, or bug reports. This is very likely a very small
percentage of the users of KDE software itself and most likely not a
very good group of those that find kde accessibility software useful
or required for their situations unfortunately. If you have any ideas
for how we could contact more users and find out who they are, what
their needs are etc. we are open to ideas.
BR,
Jeremy

Post by michel
Well, there's the greasemonkey script and the kate highlights definitions
that i made... I mention them on an other email
The colours have to be user defined, not hard coded. I don't see the point
in trying to define a certain colour code. The user can always just
change the definitions to his liking/abilities.... Also i don't think
it's that difficult to do.
Most importantly, where do i find people with visual problems?
That's more difficult then it looks like.
Can some one please help with this point?
We'll use the scripts i already made on them, and they'll report back here.
Can some one help with finding test subjects? I'm not networked with people
like that....
It isn't possible for KDE-accessibility to ask it's user to participate in
a little experiment?
Is there any KDE-accessibility leader reading this?

Post by Ovidiu-Florin Bogdan
This seems like a good idea to me.
I would recommend making a sample webpage, or a mini app, and do some
research with it on people that have visual problems. Get some feedback
from them, make some changes, find out which color combinations are
best. Find out if they would like to habe something like that on their
computer, and how much it would help them.
And finnaly make a report with all that.
I don't think implementing this in KDE would be problematic, but it must be
worth it. The development time could take some time, and no one will do
this if it turns out to be useless, or unused. The report I've mentione
would be a good selling point for the ideea.
*Ovidiu-Florin Bogdan*
GeekAliens.com[1]
Kubuntu România[2]
--------
[1] http://GeekAliens.com
[2] http://ro.kubuntu.org

_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

[Rob Whyte]

Hi,
Well put, in fact I am a text to speech user and would very much like to
be able to dive in to KDE but have access to very little of it with Orca.

Thanks
Rob Whyte

Post by Gustav Degreef
Hello,
I have serious vision problems and I've been using KDE for about 14
years. I do 90% of my computer work on linux. I am also a physician
who used to do clinical research. I am not entirely clear about the
idea of the colors/fonts yet I have read quite a bit of this thread.
Perhaps I missed some messages.
But maybe I can make a suggestion. Have a dialogue with a few visually
impaired KDE users. Find out from them where KDE is helpful and what
is missing pr needs improvement. Work/communicate directly with a few
visually impaired users. One can then "experiment" see how this idea
fits with what is needed, what could be done to put it into an
application or function. Then that preliminary application can be
tested further with a few more users. Once the application or function
is relatively mature it is ready to be tested on a larger scale. By
then one should be able to find a larger "population" of test subjects
with a more clearly defined type of visual impairment. There are
different types of visual impairment and a variety of possible "tools"
that can help. Hope this is of some use, Gustav.

Post by michel
hmmm
what about starting with adding in the default installation the colour
alphabet highlights for kate/kword i made? (very simple, not the coding of the
century)
It's everyday usable. Need to change the default to something smarter, i just
put in something random.
i think it will be at least as useful as the ascii art driver for vlc :P
They are a bunch of charities on the web. We could ask them to test the idea.
But KDE has to do that, not me. Maybe along side with Firefox? (KDE would have
to ask Firefox, not me....)
KDE/Firefox would pledge to implement the idea, if the tests seam conclusive.
There should be in advance some agreement, about what implement and conclusive
means.
(oh joy, free software politics)
What you think?

Post by Frederik Gladhorn
Michel,
That's the problem there. We developers of KDE-Accessibility
applications don't know our users. The KDE Community is trying to get
something figured out in this regard to help us find and reach out to
our users but it's not in place yet. Currently the only way we have
any knowledge of who's using our software is feedback we get by
e-mail, forums, or bug reports. This is very likely a very small
percentage of the users of KDE software itself and most likely not a
very good group of those that find kde accessibility software useful
or required for their situations unfortunately. If you have any ideas
for how we could contact more users and find out who they are, what
their needs are etc. we are open to ideas.
BR,
Jeremy

Post by michel
Well, there's the greasemonkey script and the kate highlights definitions
that i made... I mention them on an other email
The colours have to be user defined, not hard coded. I don't see the point
in trying to define a certain colour code. The user can always just
change the definitions to his liking/abilities.... Also i don't think
it's that difficult to do.
Most importantly, where do i find people with visual problems?
That's more difficult then it looks like.
Can some one please help with this point?
We'll use the scripts i already made on them, and they'll report back here.
Can some one help with finding test subjects? I'm not networked with people
like that....
It isn't possible for KDE-accessibility to ask it's user to participate in
a little experiment?
Is there any KDE-accessibility leader reading this?

Post by Ovidiu-Florin Bogdan
This seems like a good idea to me.
I would recommend making a sample webpage, or a mini app, and do some
research with it on people that have visual problems. Get some feedback
from them, make some changes, find out which color combinations are
best. Find out if they would like to habe something like that on their
computer, and how much it would help them.
And finnaly make a report with all that.
I don't think implementing this in KDE would be problematic, but it must be
worth it. The development time could take some time, and no one will do
this if it turns out to be useless, or unused. The report I've mentione
would be a good selling point for the ideea.
*Ovidiu-Florin Bogdan*
GeekAliens.com[1]
Kubuntu România[2]
--------
[1] http://GeekAliens.com
[2] http://ro.kubuntu.org

_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

[Gustav Degreef]

The KDE text to speech is handled by Jovie, which is well integrated
into KDE. It's main limitation seems to be in the poor quality of the
speech. It does not bother me, but compared with other programs it is
inferior. I recently installed Debian to try out Gnome and Orca, but I
have not gotten very far - I find Gnome very difficult to use so far. I
know that Orca can be used with KDE, but I have not yet experimented
with this. Perhaps that would be a promising direction. Gustav

Post by Rob Whyte
Hi,
Well put, in fact I am a text to speech user and would very much like to
be able to dive in to KDE but have access to very little of it with Orca.
Thanks
Rob Whyte

Post by Gustav Degreef
Hello,
I have serious vision problems and I've been using KDE for about 14
years. I do 90% of my computer work on linux. I am also a physician
who used to do clinical research. I am not entirely clear about the
idea of the colors/fonts yet I have read quite a bit of this thread.
Perhaps I missed some messages.
But maybe I can make a suggestion. Have a dialogue with a few visually
impaired KDE users. Find out from them where KDE is helpful and what
is missing pr needs improvement. Work/communicate directly with a few
visually impaired users. One can then "experiment" see how this idea
fits with what is needed, what could be done to put it into an
application or function. Then that preliminary application can be
tested further with a few more users. Once the application or function
is relatively mature it is ready to be tested on a larger scale. By
then one should be able to find a larger "population" of test subjects
with a more clearly defined type of visual impairment. There are
different types of visual impairment and a variety of possible "tools"
that can help. Hope this is of some use, Gustav.

Post by michel
hmmm
what about starting with adding in the default installation the colour
alphabet highlights for kate/kword i made? (very simple, not the coding of the
century)
It's everyday usable. Need to change the default to something smarter, i just
put in something random.
i think it will be at least as useful as the ascii art driver for vlc :P
They are a bunch of charities on the web. We could ask them to test the idea.
But KDE has to do that, not me. Maybe along side with Firefox? (KDE would have
to ask Firefox, not me....)
KDE/Firefox would pledge to implement the idea, if the tests seam conclusive.
There should be in advance some agreement, about what implement and conclusive
means.
(oh joy, free software politics)
What you think?

Post by Frederik Gladhorn
Michel,
That's the problem there. We developers of KDE-Accessibility
applications don't know our users. The KDE Community is trying to get
something figured out in this regard to help us find and reach out to
our users but it's not in place yet. Currently the only way we have
any knowledge of who's using our software is feedback we get by
e-mail, forums, or bug reports. This is very likely a very small
percentage of the users of KDE software itself and most likely not a
very good group of those that find kde accessibility software useful
or required for their situations unfortunately. If you have any ideas
for how we could contact more users and find out who they are, what
their needs are etc. we are open to ideas.
BR,
Jeremy

Post by michel
Well, there's the greasemonkey script and the kate highlights definitions
that i made... I mention them on an other email
The colours have to be user defined, not hard coded. I don't see the point
in trying to define a certain colour code. The user can always just
change the definitions to his liking/abilities.... Also i don't think
it's that difficult to do.
Most importantly, where do i find people with visual problems?
That's more difficult then it looks like.
Can some one please help with this point?
We'll use the scripts i already made on them, and they'll report back here.
Can some one help with finding test subjects? I'm not networked with people
like that....
It isn't possible for KDE-accessibility to ask it's user to participate in
a little experiment?
Is there any KDE-accessibility leader reading this?

Post by Ovidiu-Florin Bogdan
This seems like a good idea to me.
I would recommend making a sample webpage, or a mini app, and do some
research with it on people that have visual problems. Get some feedback
from them, make some changes, find out which color combinations are
best. Find out if they would like to habe something like that on their
computer, and how much it would help them.
And finnaly make a report with all that.
I don't think implementing this in KDE would be problematic, but it must be
worth it. The development time could take some time, and no one will do
this if it turns out to be useless, or unused. The report I've mentione
would be a good selling point for the ideea.
*Ovidiu-Florin Bogdan*
GeekAliens.com[1]
Kubuntu România[2]
--------
[1] http://GeekAliens.com
[2] http://ro.kubuntu.org

_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

[michel]

Dear Gustav

The idea is, not to try to see the shapes of the letters, instead, use a
colour code. It seams some misunderstood ,that it is about making the letters
easier to read (see the shape). For example if you define "a" as red on a blue
background, when you see a red blur surrounded by blue blur, you know that
it's a "a", despite the fact that you didn't actually see the "a".

The exact details are up to the user, he can use the colours that he wants,
the fonts that he wants, the zoom that he wants....etc

Apparently its not a simple thing to contact the users.
.... but you are here 3:) , we can start with you :P

I made a script for Firefox, and also for kate. To test the idea.
Firefox:
http://www.webextender.net/scripts/show/96470.html
Kate: (screenshots here!!!)
http://kde-files.org/content/show.php/Colors+alphabet?content=140780

You can try them. I'll help you if you have trouble.

please try them or a kitten will die. :'[

--------How to use the scripts--------
Kate:

http://kde-files.org/content/show.php/Colors+alphabet?content=140780

depending on your system, you need to save it in
~/.kde/share/apps/katepart/syntax
or
~/.kde4/share/apps/katepart/syntax/

restart kate
open some text
you need to activate it for a specific text
Tools > highlighting > other > colors alphabet
dada...

that was the default colours
easy configuration for custom colours
Settings > configure kate > fonts and colors > highlighting text styles
make sure you are on "other/colors alphabet"
edit it to your liking

********
Firefox:

first of all you need to install greasemonkey
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/greasemonkey/

then you install this
http://www.webextender.net/scripts/show/96470.html

you need to edit the variables in the script. I'm assuming you know something
about programs....
It's very slow because the default is terribly inefficient and broken.
But the script it's self, is good enough for testing.
By default, it uses images urls to display in place of the letters.
Just remove the url from the variables, then by default it will use the
colours (backround and the letter it self). The colours are hexadecimal code.


I'm here if you have trouble....

Hope you'll answer back

Regards

Michel

Post by Gustav Degreef
Hello,
I have serious vision problems and I've been using KDE for about 14
years. I do 90% of my computer work on linux. I am also a physician
who used to do clinical research. I am not entirely clear about the
idea of the colors/fonts yet I have read quite a bit of this thread.
Perhaps I missed some messages.
But maybe I can make a suggestion. Have a dialogue with a few visually
impaired KDE users. Find out from them where KDE is helpful and what
is missing pr needs improvement. Work/communicate directly with a few
visually impaired users. One can then "experiment" see how this idea
fits with what is needed, what could be done to put it into an
application or function. Then that preliminary application can be
tested further with a few more users. Once the application or function
is relatively mature it is ready to be tested on a larger scale. By
then one should be able to find a larger "population" of test subjects
with a more clearly defined type of visual impairment. There are
different types of visual impairment and a variety of possible "tools"
that can help. Hope this is of some use, Gustav.

Post by michel
hmmm
what about starting with adding in the default installation the colour
alphabet highlights for kate/kword i made? (very simple, not the coding of
the century)
It's everyday usable. Need to change the default to something smarter, i
just put in something random.
i think it will be at least as useful as the ascii art driver for vlc :P
They are a bunch of charities on the web. We could ask them to test the
idea. But KDE has to do that, not me. Maybe along side with Firefox? (KDE
would have to ask Firefox, not me....)
KDE/Firefox would pledge to implement the idea, if the tests seam
conclusive. There should be in advance some agreement, about what
implement and conclusive means.
(oh joy, free software politics)
What you think?

Post by Frederik Gladhorn
Michel,
That's the problem there. We developers of KDE-Accessibility
applications don't know our users. The KDE Community is trying to get
something figured out in this regard to help us find and reach out to
our users but it's not in place yet. Currently the only way we have
any knowledge of who's using our software is feedback we get by
e-mail, forums, or bug reports. This is very likely a very small
percentage of the users of KDE software itself and most likely not a
very good group of those that find kde accessibility software useful
or required for their situations unfortunately. If you have any ideas
for how we could contact more users and find out who they are, what
their needs are etc. we are open to ideas.
BR,
Jeremy

Post by michel
Well, there's the greasemonkey script and the kate highlights definitions
that i made... I mention them on an other email
The colours have to be user defined, not hard coded. I don't see the point
in trying to define a certain colour code. The user can always just
change the definitions to his liking/abilities.... Also i don't think
it's that difficult to do.
Most importantly, where do i find people with visual problems?
That's more difficult then it looks like.
Can some one please help with this point?
We'll use the scripts i already made on them, and they'll report back here.
Can some one help with finding test subjects? I'm not networked with people
like that....
It isn't possible for KDE-accessibility to ask it's user to participate in
a little experiment?
Is there any KDE-accessibility leader reading this?

Post by Ovidiu-Florin Bogdan
This seems like a good idea to me.
I would recommend making a sample webpage, or a mini app, and do some
research with it on people that have visual problems. Get some feedback
from them, make some changes, find out which color combinations are
best. Find out if they would like to habe something like that on their
computer, and how much it would help them.
And finnaly make a report with all that.
I don't think implementing this in KDE would be problematic, but it
must
be
worth it. The development time could take some time, and no one will do
this if it turns out to be useless, or unused. The report I've mentione
would be a good selling point for the ideea.
*Ovidiu-Florin Bogdan*
GeekAliens.com[1]
Kubuntu România[2]
--------
[1] http://GeekAliens.com
[2] http://ro.kubuntu.org

_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

[Gustav Degreef]

Post by michel
Dear Gustav
The idea is, not to try to see the shapes of the letters, instead, use a
colour code. It seams some misunderstood ,that it is about making the letters
easier to read (see the shape). For example if you define "a" as red on a blue
background, when you see a red blur surrounded by blue blur, you know that
it's a "a", despite the fact that you didn't actually see the "a".
The exact details are up to the user, he can use the colours that he wants,
the fonts that he wants, the zoom that he wants....etc
Apparently its not a simple thing to contact the users.
.... but you are here 3:) , we can start with you :P
I made a script for Firefox, and also for kate. To test the idea.
http://www.webextender.net/scripts/show/96470.html
Kate: (screenshots here!!!)
http://kde-files.org/content/show.php/Colors+alphabet?content=140780
You can try them. I'll help you if you have trouble.
please try them or a kitten will die. :'[
--------How to use the scripts--------
http://kde-files.org/content/show.php/Colors+alphabet?content=140780

Fascinating idea! However, all the links return a "server not found"
error !?
The kitten did not die :) Gustav.

[Gustav Degreef]

Post by michel
Dear Gustav
The idea is, not to try to see the shapes of the letters, instead, use a
colour code. It seams some misunderstood ,that it is about making the letters
easier to read (see the shape). For example if you define "a" as red on a blue
background, when you see a red blur surrounded by blue blur, you know that
it's a "a", despite the fact that you didn't actually see the "a".
The exact details are up to the user, he can use the colours that he wants,
the fonts that he wants, the zoom that he wants....etc
Apparently its not a simple thing to contact the users.
.... but you are here 3:) , we can start with you :P
I made a script for Firefox, and also for kate. To test the idea.
http://www.webextender.net/scripts/show/96470.html
Kate: (screenshots here!!!)
http://kde-files.org/content/show.php/Colors+alphabet?content=140780
You can try them. I'll help you if you have trouble.
please try them or a kitten will die. :'[
--------How to use the scripts--------
http://kde-files.org/content/show.php/Colors+alphabet?content=140780
depending on your system, you need to save it in
~/.kde/share/apps/katepart/syntax
or
~/.kde4/share/apps/katepart/syntax/

OK, I tot it. I am using KDE4.10.5. I have ~/.kde4/share/apps/kate -
no dir /katepart
/kate has 2 subdirs /plugins and /filegree. plugins has 3 subdirs none
of them named syntax.

I took a look at the screenshots. Pretty nifty, It's essentially a
different script for the same language. I'd like to see it in kate, but
the screenshots suffer from poor resolution and as they are zoomed they
loose their value. What is the maximum resolution? In any case it's a
remarkable idea, Gustav.

[michel]

try creating the directory and put it in.
I hope that will work....
I have kate directory too, it's not the one.

about the screen shots and their resolution, either i was sloppy, or it was
enforced by the site. I don't remember.

About the greasemonkey script.
Last time i checked, it didn't work on chrome! So try it on Firefox...
You'll need to edit the script by hand.
you can define in the options for greasemonkey to use an external editor
it needs the full path, for kate that would be:
"/usr/bin/kate"
you need to have greasemonkey activated AND the script activated.
And then reload the page

Don't run it with the defaults, it's a bit broken.
The default actually uses a picture alphabet, but the pictures are very large,
on top of it, some pictures got deleted, so it gets extremely slow. Firefox
hasn't crashed....

in the script 3/4 of it it's variables
it's easy to notice
the first one (a) is commented at every line
the second (b) is more typical


//AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
//which character you are treating
character[0] = 'a';
//you are replacing it by which character, if linkimg is empty
replcharacter[0] ='a';
//do you want to use the special font you defined at var "SpecialFont" above?,
ignored if linkimg is not empty
UseSpecialFont[0] = false;
//link of the replacement image, if given, the othe transformation parameters
will be ignored
linkimg[0] = 'Loading Image...';
//defines the color of the character, if linkimg is empty
colors[0] = '#f01';
//defines the color of the background of the character, if linkimg is empty
colorbackground[0] = '#ff0';

//BBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBBB
character[1] = 'b';
replcharacter[1] ='b';
UseSpecialFont[1] = false;
linkimg[1] ='Loading Image...';
colors[1] = 'blue';
colorbackground[1] = 'red';

you just need to delete the urls
so this
linkimg[1] ='http://i148.photobucket.com/albums/s34/kimbero53/disney/071.gif';
becomes this
linkimg[1] ='';
it has to be exactly like this, or the script will brake. with the '';
You can use other pictures if you want..... Some of the urls are broken, and
that kills the the speed, because it tryies to find pictures that don't exist.
Also, i was lasy, and i just thrown in normall big pictures from photobuket.
If you really want to use this, you should use small images....
Copy paste still works even with the images, as normal text....
Other wise, that feature of the script works properly.

if the url is missing, then it will use the colors
colors[1] = 'blue';
colorbackground[1] = 'red';
"colors" is the color of the letter it self
"colorbackground" is the backround arond the letter only.
you can use hexadecimal color codes as arguments in the variables

a generic hexadecimal code looks like this
colors[5] = '#EE82EE';
colorbackground[5] = '#FF8243';

you can easily find with an other program or on the internet the codes for the
colors you want to use.

.... yea, it's experimental, not for dummies :P
normally the script should process a normal page in a barely acceptable 2
seconds...
I didn't arse my self with the default as you can see. It's just random
colours, you should use a more practical color code. What ever you want.

Tell me if you get in to trouble with the technical side.

Post by Gustav Degreef

Post by michel
Dear Gustav
The idea is, not to try to see the shapes of the letters, instead, use a
colour code. It seams some misunderstood ,that it is about making the
letters easier to read (see the shape). For example if you define "a" as
red on a blue background, when you see a red blur surrounded by blue
blur, you know that it's a "a", despite the fact that you didn't actually
see the "a".
The exact details are up to the user, he can use the colours that he wants,
the fonts that he wants, the zoom that he wants....etc
Apparently its not a simple thing to contact the users.
.... but you are here 3:) , we can start with you :P
I made a script for Firefox, and also for kate. To test the idea.
http://www.webextender.net/scripts/show/96470.html
Kate: (screenshots here!!!)
http://kde-files.org/content/show.php/Colors+alphabet?content=140780
You can try them. I'll help you if you have trouble.
please try them or a kitten will die. :'[
--------How to use the scripts--------
http://kde-files.org/content/show.php/Colors+alphabet?content=140780
depending on your system, you need to save it in
~/.kde/share/apps/katepart/syntax
or
~/.kde4/share/apps/katepart/syntax/

OK, I tot it. I am using KDE4.10.5. I have ~/.kde4/share/apps/kate -
no dir /katepart
/kate has 2 subdirs /plugins and /filegree. plugins has 3 subdirs none
of them named syntax.
I took a look at the screenshots. Pretty nifty, It's essentially a
different script for the same language. I'd like to see it in kate, but
the screenshots suffer from poor resolution and as they are zoomed they
loose their value. What is the maximum resolution? In any case it's a
remarkable idea, Gustav.
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https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

[Gustav Degreef]

Post by michel
try creating the directory and put it in.
I hope that will work....

Sadly, it does not work.

Post by michel
I have kate directory too, it's not the one.
about the screen shots and their resolution, either i was sloppy, or it was
enforced by the site. I don't remember.

The resolution is the major issue for "testing". There is a concept in
scientific research, it is called "signal to noise ratio". For the
signal to be perceived, for it to have an action, etc, the should be as
free of noise as possible. The more "noise" - distortion, impurity, etc
that is associated/transmitted with the signal, the lower the signal to
noise ratio. The lower the signal to noise ratio, the less likely that
that signal will cause the desired effect/action.

The screenshots show a "noisy" signal. I found them very difficult to
process visually. Partly the resolution, partly some of the colors are
hard to tell apart and partly there was not enough contrast between the
letter and the background, to make each "character clearly
distinguishable from others.

Post by michel
About the greasemonkey script.

All of that is way too complicated for me to deal with given my visual
impairment. I avoid highly complex reading as much as possible because
it is a strain. The same would be for most visually impaired people.

It is a fascinating idea. However, it seems to be in an "alpha" state,
not yet beta ready for testing - with visually impaired subjects.
Perhaps if I could see it in kate, I might give better feedback. Good
luck, Gustav.

[Burkhard Lück]

Post by Gustav Degreef

Post by michel
try creating the directory and put it in.
I hope that will work....

Sadly, it does not work.

Please create the folder "~/.kde4/share/apps/katepart/syntax/" and copy the
file 140780-ColorsAlphabet.xml from
http://kde-files.org/content/show.php/Colors+alphabet?content=140780 into this
folder.

Then start KWrite or Kate, select Tools->Highlighting-Other->Colors alphabet

Just tested this and it works.

[Gustav Degreef]

Post by Burkhard Lück

Post by Gustav Degreef

Post by michel
try creating the directory and put it in.
I hope that will work....

Sadly, it does not work.

Please create the folder "~/.kde4/share/apps/katepart/syntax/" and copy the
file 140780-ColorsAlphabet.xml from
http://kde-files.org/content/show.php/Colors+alphabet?content=140780 into this
folder.
Then start KWrite or Kate, select Tools->Highlighting-Other->Colors alphabet
Just tested this and it works.

Yes, it does. The problem was that the download button opens the script
on a new page and I was somehow not downloading the proper file. Looks
better than the webpage.

To read on the computer I use a special "telescopic" lens on my
glasses. I can not read otherwise unless I enlarge the font.

For me, it still harder to deal than the same black text on a black
background. For me optimal is yellow text on black background and in a
larger font.

Your special backgrounds/characters are harder for me to deal with
either with or without the telescopic lens. I am not sure if I would
have to "learn" how to process them, so as to make use of them. I had
to learn to use this telescope, and any new device/technique requires
some learning before it becomes useful. Gustav.

[michel]

Dear Gustav

.... yea, the colour alphabet requires some learning curve. You can learn any
new alphabet in a week, but read fluidly quite a bit longer....

"harder for me to deal with"

The default is crap, just a demo. I just put in random colours. Even, all the
numbers are the same colour :P. You'll need to chose what is easy for you.

you can change the colours here (easy GUI with easy colour selector)
Settings>configure kate>Fonts and colors>hilighting text styles

Remember, the strategy is not to see the shapes, but to use the colours as
information carriers.

They are various things you can experiment with. I don't have your eyes, you
have to do this your self.

You can experiment with various details, like zoom and fonts. The fonts can be
normal, or just some special fonts to increase the visibility of both colours.
You can try the brutal, one colour for both the letter and background, you'll
need then to be able to distinguish between 24 colours.... You can set all
letters to normal, except for those that give you the most trouble. With this
i believe you should see an instantaneous small improvement in your reading
abilities. You should try, at least this last one, it's the easiest. Try to be
creative.....

I'll edit and send you the greasemonkey script with your choices, if you are
interested.

With custom colours you chose. Does it get any easier on your eyes?
You can't read fluidly immediately, that will take some time.
My question concerns the purely sensory aspect. Actual fluid reading requires
some learning curve.

Regards

Michel

Post by Gustav Degreef

Post by Burkhard Lück

Post by Gustav Degreef

Post by michel
try creating the directory and put it in.
I hope that will work....

Sadly, it does not work.

Please create the folder "~/.kde4/share/apps/katepart/syntax/" and copy the
file 140780-ColorsAlphabet.xml from
http://kde-files.org/content/show.php/Colors+alphabet?content=140780 into
this folder.
Then start KWrite or Kate, select Tools->Highlighting-Other->Colors alphabet
Just tested this and it works.

Yes, it does. The problem was that the download button opens the script
on a new page and I was somehow not downloading the proper file. Looks
better than the webpage.
To read on the computer I use a special "telescopic" lens on my
glasses. I can not read otherwise unless I enlarge the font.
For me, it still harder to deal than the same black text on a black
background. For me optimal is yellow text on black background and in a
larger font.
Your special backgrounds/characters are harder for me to deal with
either with or without the telescopic lens. I am not sure if I would
have to "learn" how to process them, so as to make use of them. I had
to learn to use this telescope, and any new device/technique requires
some learning before it becomes useful. Gustav.
_______________________________________________
kde-accessibility mailing list
https://mail.kde.org/mailman/listinfo/kde-accessibility

[michel]

Dear Gustav

my comments are bellow your's

Post by michel
They are various things you can experiment with. I don't have your eyes,
you have to do this your self.

I think you need to learn more about visual problems before you can
assist people who have serious visual impairment. This is a
fascinating, perhaps promising project. I don't know it's potential -
at this point it's a theory.

Visual problems vary a lot.

[Gustav Degreef]

Post by michel
Dear Gustav
my comments are bellow your's

Post by michel
They are various things you can experiment with. I don't have your eyes,
you have to do this your self.

I think you need to learn more about visual problems before you can
assist people who have serious visual impairment. This is a
fascinating, perhaps promising project. I don't know it's potential -
at this point it's a theory.

Visual problems vary a lot. From the nearly normal to the almost blind. With
weird variations.
It's not possible to give all sizes fit all solution.
They are some people, that they have to literally put their faces right in
front of a screen, with letters magnified to almost the full hight of the
screen , to be able to read. These, would benefit hands down with a colour
alphabet....
The user has to define the colours that best uses what is left of his vision.
In combination with other existing methods like zooming......
At the very least, reading will become less straining.
Individualized solutions, will always beet "mass produced" generic solutions.

Post by michel
The default is crap, just a demo. I just put in random colours. Even, all
the numbers are the same colour :P. You'll need to chose what is easy for
you.

I think that would be true with a proven "technology". This is still in
the experimental state, pre-alpha. I don't have other assitive tech
that I am struggling with, learning to cope with. I think you need to
refine this.

The "technology", is supposed to make it easy for you to change the colours.
For kate, the redefinition of colours is simple. It's all gui, no need to edit
a cryptic config file. No one will code something easier, until he gets
feedback, that the idea will be actually be used in real life....
I can edit the file for you, if that's the real concern...
You still need to tell me what colours you want though...
I'm not going to suck that from my thumb...
At the very least, try this.
Change all backgrounds to black, and the letters to yellow( like what you use
now).
Then change one letter and it's background to a different colour, a letter that
challenges you the most. For example, a dyslexic would chose "b" or "d". I
would chose red. So in my example, you'll have a red rectangle in place of "b"
and all the rest, yellow on black.
With a test like this, you should see and immediate small improvement.
..... i can just edit the file for you. You'll just need to delete the old, put
in the new and restart kate. (a new default)
I can prepare all the configurations that you would want to test....

This is a fascinating, perhaps promising project.

You could at least stay and endure some experimentation?
It's hard to find people with visual impairments.
Or maybe help me find some volunteers?
....You get KDE for free, this could be your small way in contributing
something back....
Also, think of the kittens :P
I'm trying not to abuse your patience..... :)
regards
Michel

I appreciate your efforts to help visually impaired KDE users and your
efforts are commendable. Due to other commitments I can not commit time
to this worthy idea. Please excuse any comments on my part that have
come across as "critical". I have no criticism for your ideas, my
comments are only an effort to contribute. At present, I can not
contribute hands on experimentation, I can only contribute ideas. If
those ideas are not helpful, please discard them.

The tools I have which have been most helpful, I obtained at an
excellent low vision center in Indiana, US. There are a number of such
low vision centers. Usually an optometrist (non-physician) or
ophthalmologist (physician) is in charge of the center. You could find
one in your locale and talk to the director to see if you could "test"
your project on some of their patients. Alternatively you could speak
to a someone in the local university who is doing research on visual
impairment and they could help guide you as to which population of
visually impaired subjects may be most helped. You could also make a
poster presentation and apply to present it at an ophthalmology
conference. In this way you could make a personal connection with a
physician who could help you with getting your project tested on their
patients.

I would suggest refining the project before further "testing". You
yourself mention that some aspects of it are still "rudimentary". For
example, it needs a clear strategy to deal with numbers, spaces between
words and how to deal with punctuation and non numeric characters
(*,@,#, etc.). Best wishes, Gustav.